{"id":12502,"date":"2023-09-29T02:44:54","date_gmt":"2023-09-29T02:44:54","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/azpregnancyhelp.com\/?p=12502"},"modified":"2023-09-29T02:46:45","modified_gmt":"2023-09-29T02:46:45","slug":"adoption-choices-in-arizona-unplanned-pregnancy","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/azpregnancyhelp.com\/adoption-choices-in-arizona-unplanned-pregnancy\/","title":{"rendered":"Birth Mother Matters in Adoption Episode #100 \u2013 The End of Era"},"content":{"rendered":"

Ron Reigns: <\/span>Welcome. Thank you for joining us on \u2018Birth Mother Matters in Adoption\u2019 with Kelly Rourke-Scarry and me, Ron Reigns, where we delve into the issues of adoption from every angle of the adoption triad and share information about adoption choices in Arizona.<\/p>\n

\n

Speaker 3:
\nDo what\u2019s best for your kid and yourself because if you can\u2019t take care of yourself, you won\u2019t be able to care for that kid. And that\u2019s not fair.<\/p>\n

Speaker 4:
\nAnd I know my daughter would be well cared for with them.<\/p>\n

Speaker 5:
\nDon\u2019t have an abortion. Give this child a chance.<\/p>\n

Speaker 6:
\nAll I could think about was needing to save my son.<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nMy name is Kelly Rourke-Scarry. I\u2019m the executive director, president and co-founder of Building Arizona Family\u2019s adoption agency, the Donna K. Evans Foundation and creator of the You Before Me campaign. I have a bachelor\u2019s degree in family studies and human development and a master\u2019s degree in education with an emphasis in school counseling. I was adopted at the age of three days, born to a teen birth mother, raised in a closed adoption and reunited with my birth mother in 2007. I have worked in the adoption field for over 15 years.<\/p>\n

Ron Reigns:
\nAnd I\u2019m Ron Reigns. I\u2019ve worked in radio since 1999. I was the co-host of two successful morning shows in Prescott, Arizona. Now, I work for my wife, who\u2019s an adoption attorney, and I\u2019m able to combine these two great passions and share them on this podcast.<\/p>\n

Ron Reigns:
\nThis is our 100th episode and final episode of season one. So in honor of making it this far with \u2018Birth Mother Matters in Adoption\u2019, we thought it would be interesting to take a look back at some of our past episodes. The one topic that\u2019s come up the most in these podcasts, other than, of course, the general topic of adoption, is abortion. And that subject was first broached on episode three of the show.<\/p>\n

Ron Reigns:
\nHere we go. It might be controversial. But we\u2019re going to broach the subject.<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nWe\u2019re going to go there.<\/p>\n

Ron Reigns:
\nYeah. We\u2019re doing it.<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nWe\u2019re going to go there.<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nI will tell you upfront I have never lost an abortion debate ever.<\/p>\n

Ron Reigns:
\nEver?<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nEver.<\/p>\n

Ron Reigns:
\nNot with anybody?<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nNobody.<\/p>\n

Ron Reigns:
\nAnd you\u2019ve been on TV about this.<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nI have been on TV.<\/p>\n

Ron Reigns:
\nOkay.<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nI have been on TV, and you can actually go to our campaign\u2019s website, which we\u2019ll give you at the end of this podcast. And you can see it.<\/p>\n

Ron Reigns:
\nOkay.<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nAs I was stating, I have never lost an abortion debate. And part of that is because I was born seven days prior to Roe v. Wade, becoming legal.<\/p>\n

Ron Reigns:
\nAnd it\u2019s made such a difference in your life-<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nI\u2019m here.<\/p>\n

Ron Reigns:
\nObviously. Not being aborted, for instance-<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nRight.<\/p>\n

Ron Reigns:
\nbut also being adopted and knowing what that means to a human life.<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nI do. Absolutely. I don\u2019t know whether or not my mother would\u2019ve chosen abortion as a route to go again. She didn\u2019t know that she was pregnant with me until three weeks before. But I think maybe that may have been a little bit of denial. And not sure, I mean, she was 15 when she became pregnant.<\/p>\n

Ron Reigns:
\nRight.<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nAnd had just turned 16 when she had me. And that\u2019s a little bit of a funny story, actually that I will share in another podcast.<\/p>\n

Ron Reigns:
\nOkay. I can\u2019t wait.<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nYes. All right. So the \u2018You Before Me\u2019 campaign was developed because Busy Phillips had come up with a campaign called \u2018You Know Me\u2019, this campaign was to let women know that one out of four women, by the time they turned 45, have had an abortion. I couldn\u2019t believe the numbers.<\/p>\n

Ron Reigns:
\nRight.<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nOne in four women. And so what she was doing, the campaign\u2019s goal was to let women know, \u201cHey, you\u2019re not alone. You know me, I\u2019ve had one.\u201d And I thought, wait a minute. I haven\u2019t had one. I\u2019ve known people that have had one, but it\u2019s not something that people normally celebrate or it\u2019s not something that they look at and they say, \u201cHey, I had a cheeseburger today. You know me.\u201d<\/p>\n

Ron Reigns:
\nRight, right.<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nAnd so I thought we\u2019re desensitizing people to what abortion really is. And we\u2019re not sensitizing people to what adoption is. And who\u2019s the real hero here? It\u2019s the birth mothers who are making that choice, who are making that sacrifice, who are living what other people are choosing not to. They\u2019re taking the nine months, and they\u2019re going through all of the weight gain and the hormone changes. And they\u2019re feeling the baby kick inside. And they\u2019re going through labor and delivery. And they\u2019re making this unbelievable choice where we\u2019ve got another person out there who\u2019s rallying people to say, \u201cHey, you know me, this is what I did. I did the quick and easy fix.\u201d<\/p>\n

Ron Reigns:
\nRight.<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nAnd it\u2019s not quick and it\u2019s not easy. And many people who have had an abortion will say there are long-term life consequences of it.<\/p>\n

Ron Reigns:
\nAbsolutely. Lasting impacts that just don\u2019t go away when the baby goes away.<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nRight. You know, in the future, I want to have some guests on here that I know personally that have had an abortion. There\u2019s a woman who I spoke with, and she had one about almost 30 years ago. And she said, it\u2019s still something she thinks about every day. She said, it\u2019s, she looks at her two sons and she thinks, is one missing? Should I have done something differently? Would they still be here if I hadn\u2019t had an abortion? And so there\u2019s so many questions that are left unanswered.<\/p>\n

Ron Reigns:
\nAs I mentioned, abortion is a recurring theme on this podcast. And probably the hardest episode so far for me to record was episode 16. When I talked about my own experience with abortion.<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nHow long after the abortion did you start to feel the effects?<\/p>\n

Ron Reigns:
\nIt certainly wasn\u2019t immediate. I think, maybe a couple of years. And then I really started looking back on it and thinking, what have I done?<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nWas it before or after the birth of your son?<\/p>\n

Ron Reigns:
\nIt\u2019s been so long ago. I\u2019m going to say, honestly, it might have been when she was pregnant with my son.<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nThat makes sense. That would be a huge trigger.<\/p>\n

Ron Reigns:
\nYeah. And as I had said, she had gone through two abortions. So I guess at the time, I was so young and very naive. Didn\u2019t realize the consequences, not just emotionally on me, that\u2019s beside the point, but on what I, on what I had; I can\u2019t even do this here. Hold on.<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nJust take your time.<\/p>\n

Ron Reigns:
\nThe consequences on the life that was never allowed to be.<\/p>\n

Ron Reigns:
\nBecause of the choice I had made.<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nYou are so brave to talk about this because I believe that what you\u2019re saying is saving lives.<\/p>\n

Ron Reigns:
\nI hope so. I hope somebody will hear this and go wait, am I choosing the wrong thing here? Or how will this affect me when I\u2019m 50?<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nYou don\u2019t have the ability, unfortunately, to go back and change the past.<\/p>\n

Ron Reigns:
\nNo.<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nBut you have the ability to talk to other birth fathers because men, in a lot of instances, would prefer to hear it from another man. And that\u2019s what I\u2019ve been told when I speak with birth fathers. And you have the platform and the opportunity to share because there may be birth fathers out there and they\u2019re with their pregnant girlfriend, one nightstand, somebody, and they may think, \u201cWell, abortion is a really quick fix to get out of this.\u201d But there is unplanned pregnancy support in Arizona available to help pregnant woman have access to necessary resources.<\/p>\n

Ron Reigns:
\nYeah.<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nIt\u2019s really something that we can just put behind us and move on.<\/p>\n

Ron Reigns:
\nYeah.<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nAnd because you\u2019re being courageous and you\u2019re able to share your story, I really do believe that if there\u2019s a heaven, your baby\u2019s looking down, giving you the thumbs up.<\/p>\n

Ron Reigns:
\nThat one\u2019s still hard for me to listen to. We also talked with a set of birth parents on episode 39. And their story was terrifying, breathtaking and powerful. All at the same time.<\/p>\n

Speaker 8:
\nAll I saw was money. I didn\u2019t care about anything and nobody until that moment, me realizing that it was me, that I was the problem with the neighborhood. And that I was the problem with everybody\u2019s family. And while all these kids are getting neglected, while all these kids were finally, the women are pregnant and they\u2019re coming out and the babies are in drugs. They\u2019re pretty much high. And I was the source of it. And I just couldn\u2019t do it any more. I knew that if I didn\u2019t break the cycle somewhere along the line, that I would be the source of making society so much worse. And it\u2019s like, who am I to make the choices with everybody\u2019s life? I\u2019m nobody. And it\u2019s just; in my mind, it\u2019s just wrong in so many ways. Before I didn\u2019t care, it didn\u2019t mean nothing to me. If this girl was high, getting high while she was pregnant, doing heroin or smoking meth, I didn\u2019t care as long as I got money, it meant nothing to me.<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nAnd you made a lot of money?<\/p>\n

Speaker 8:
\nOh yeah.<\/p>\n

Speaker 9:
\nYeah. He used to make a lot-<\/p>\n

Speaker 8:
\nYeah.<\/p>\n

Speaker 9:
\nof money.<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nSo what\u2019s a lot of money? Like what? Like if you had to say.<\/p>\n

Speaker 8:
\n$200,000 within a week.<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nSo how did you actually, you can\u2019t just stop or turn that off. Like you can\u2019t. How did you do it? Did you go to rehab? Did you\u2026?<\/p>\n

Speaker 8:
\nI just stopped and turned it off all along. And I didn\u2019t go anywhere.<\/p>\n

Speaker 9:
\nIt was pretty much my daughter being taken and stuff-<\/p>\n

Speaker 8:
\nI didn\u2019t go anywhere.<\/p>\n

Speaker 9:
\nThat changed a lot of his outlook on a lot of things. Because for months, he tried to get me to go to UMom and everything like that. And I was just stuck in the streets, pretty much. And even though I was taking care of my daughter she had everything she needed. She had all her clothes, she had food, every night, everything like that. She had a place to sleep. It was just, I was just consumed with the streets too at the same time.<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nIn what way?<\/p>\n

Speaker 8:
\nIn every way. She like literally, if she seen somebody that was selling drugs and the affection felt like that was the person, that was that shining the most in the neighborhood, that\u2019s who she liked to attract to.<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nThe reason I\u2019m asking you guys these questions is because I\u2019m on the other side. So I\u2019ve got to learn because I\u2019m trying to help other people. And so if you don\u2019t teach me, you\u2019re not going to learn this in a book.<\/p>\n

Speaker 8:
\nNo, you can\u2019t. It\u2019s impossibility.<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nI know.<\/p>\n

Speaker 8:
\nI call it the art of manipulation through heroin, especially when girls are on heroin. And people think that these girls are like hoping for me, but really they\u2019re not. What I\u2019m doing is I\u2019m literally fronting them drugs here because I know they need it, and I\u2019ll give them heroin upfront, and I\u2019ll just keep giving it to them and keep giving it to them. And when they run up a bill, I make them go get it by any means necessary. That means that they got to go and post their ad on the internet and have to sell for this. That\u2019s what they got to go do. And they go get my money for me. And because I\u2019m really pimping them, it\u2019s because they owe me money and I\u2019m a drug dealer and they want more drugs from me.<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nSo they\u2019ll do anything?<\/p>\n

Speaker 8:
\nSo they go and they\u2019ll go do anything whatever\u2019s necessary to give me my money. Like I lived a really-really rough life. And the last thing I ever want for any of my kids is to live the life that I live. And I know that this is probably like, I can\u2019t just go and just give my child to anybody and think that they\u2019re going to live a good life. I can go somewhere like this and know for a fact that I could pick a family that, this is going to do the right thing. And I know for a fact that my child\u2019s going to live a good life. I know they\u2019re going to be loved. I know they\u2019re going to be cared for. I know they\u2019re going to be clothed. I know they\u2019re going to be healthy. I know they\u2019re going to get educated. I know they\u2019re probably going to go to college.<\/p>\n

Speaker 9:
\nMy two kids that I gave up for adoption right now, one of them is in pageants and the other one, they want to put in pageants. My, the one I just had, they want to have her put in pageants too. Mmmmm, so.<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nYou guys are amazing.<\/p>\n

Speaker 8:
\nThank you. I think you guys are amazing. You sit there and you work your whole life and make sure that these children have somewhere good to go and then make sure that the family that\u2019s putting the child up is taken good care of. That\u2019s a beautiful thing to me. I respect you guys in so many ways.<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nThank you.<\/p>\n

Ron Reigns:
\nIf you haven\u2019t listened to that episode, I encourage you to go back and listen to this interview in its entirety. Its episode 39. Adoption in the news has been another reappearing theme throughout the first season of \u2018Birth Mother Matters in Adoption\u2019. And one of the biggest adoption news stories in Arizona, was the case of Paul Peterson. And we first talked about it in episode 15, way back in October, 2019. The Maricopa County Assessor and adoption attorney who was arrested this past Tuesday, October 8th and indicted on 32 counts in Arizona, including conspiracy, fraudulent schemes and practices, theft and forgery. He\u2019s facing at least 62 federal and state charges, including charges in Utah and Arkansas.<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nWhat I find really interesting about this case is this has gone on for what appears to be a few years. And this is now just coming to light. Where I\u2019m really excited to talk to you, Ron, about this is not only to dig into the material that has been released by different media sources, different areas such as court paperwork, other professionals\u2019 opinions is really the present and future impact on adoptions. We, as adoption professionals, can support the adoption community and any potential backlash or myths or misunderstandings that may occur as a result of what Mr. Peterson alleged.<\/p>\n

Ron Reigns:
\nRight. And now you take a very optimistic view. You don\u2019t think that adoptions are going to decrease. And I\u2019m kind of, of the same mind. And in a way, I think this may shine a light on the adoption industry to where people go. Adoption. I forgot about adoption.<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nWhat we know so far from the information that we\u2019ve gathered is investigators in Arizona found 28 women from the Marshall island gave birth in Phoenix area, hospitals between November 30th, 2015 and May 30th, 2019, according to the court documents. The women, as they waited as long as six months to deliver their children, lived in a MESA home owned by Peterson. Eight pregnant women were also found at the residence in MESA. So that\u2019s the starting point. During this three year period, they were brought here from the Marshall Islands to have their babies to then have them adopted to families in the United States.<\/p>\n

Ron Reigns:
\nCorrect.<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nWe have also learned, from the Department of public safety, that Mr. Peterson had been involved in adoptions of Marshallese babies since at least 2005.<\/p>\n

Ron Reigns:
\nAt least. Right.<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nThat\u2019s one thing with Building Arizona Families that I\u2019ve always stated to all of our workers, as well as the families that adopt through us and our birth mothers is transparency is vital in adoption.<\/p>\n

Ron Reigns:
\nYeah, hopefully this will chase out some of the outliers and the bad elements. You know, the bad actors in this. Do you think that there are adoption attorneys and adoption agencies that, due to the light being shown on Peterson\u2019s case, might start getting very nervous about their own practices?<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nIf they\u2019re not on the up and up.<\/p>\n

Ron Reigns:
\nOkay.<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nI think adoptive families or families that are considering adoption don\u2019t need to be scared. I think they need to look at it as a wake up call in the sense that do your education, do your research, check and see if the agency is licensed. See how long they\u2019ve held their license, check and see if their license has ever been suspended. Check and see if they hold any other accreditations. Check and see if they\u2019re registered with a Better Business Bureau. Check and see who their affiliates are. This is where, when you are buying a home or you are even buying a car, you do a lot of research.<\/p>\n

Ron Reigns:
\nRight.<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nThat\u2019s incomparable to adding a family member.<\/p>\n

Ron Reigns:
\nRight. Exactly.<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nIt\u2019s not at the same level, because you\u2019re not just talking about a monetary expense. You\u2019re talking about an emotional expense, a physical expense.<\/p>\n

Ron Reigns:
\nYeah<\/p>\n

Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
\nBecause of the toll it\u2019s going to take on you. I mean, adopting a child is going to affect every aspect of your life.<\/p>\n

Ron Reigns:
\nThroughout season one of this podcast, we\u2019ve tried to educate birth parents, adoptive families and adoptive children on the good, the bad and the ugly of adoption. We\u2019ve tried to clear up some of the myths about adoption. We\u2019ve also tried to highlight news events concerning adoption and abortion and keep the listeners informed. And help women who are experiencing unplanned pregnancy know their adoption choices in Arizona. And hopefully, we\u2019ve even entertained somebody along the way. Thank you to all of the listeners for coming along on this ride through season one, and we hope to get even better in season two.<\/p>\n

Ron Reigns:
\nThank you for joining us on \u2018Birth Mother Matters in Adoption\u2019. If you\u2019re listening and you\u2019re looking for pregnancy help in Arizona and want more information about adoption choices in Arizona, Building Arizona Families<\/a> is a local Arizona adoption agency and available 24*7 by phone or text at (623) 695-4112; that\u2019s (623) 695-4112. We can make an immediate appointment with you to get started on creating an Arizona adoption plan, or just get you more information. You can also find out more information about AZ Pregnancy Help on their website www.azpregnancyhelp.com<\/a>. Thanks also go out to Grapes for allowing us to use their song \u2018I Don\u2019t Know\u2019 as our theme song. Birth Mother Matters in Adoption was written and produced by Kelly Rourke-Scarry and edited by me. Please rate and review this podcast wherever you\u2019re listening to us. We\u2019d really appreciate it. We also now have a website\u00a0www.birthmothermatterspodcast.com<\/a>, tune in next time on \u2018Birth Mother Matters in Adoption\u2019 for Kelly Rourke-Scarry. I\u2019m Ron Reigns.<\/p>\n<\/div>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

Ron Reigns: Welcome. Thank you for joining us on \u2018Birth Mother Matters in Adoption\u2019 with Kelly Rourke-Scarry and me, Ron Reigns, where we delve into the issues of adoption from every angle of the adoption triad and share information about adoption choices in Arizona. 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