Ron Reigns:
Welcome, and thank you for joining us on Birth Mother Matters in Adoption with Kelly Rourke-Scarry and me Ron Reigns where we delve into the issues of adoption from every angle of the adoption triad.
Speaker 2:
Do what’s best for your kid and for yourself, because if you can’t take care of yourself you’re definitely not going to be able to take care of that kid and that’s not fair.
Speaker 3:
I know that my daughter would be well taken care of with them.
Speaker 4:
Don’t have an abortion. Give this child a chance.
Speaker 5:
All I could think about was needing to save my son.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
My name is Kelly Rourke-Scarry. I’m the executive director, president, and co-founder of Building Arizona Families Adoption Agency, The Donna Kay Evans Foundation, and creator of the You Before Me campaign. I have a bachelor’s degree in family studies in human development and a master’s degree in education with an emphasis in school counseling. I was adopted at the age of three days, born to a teen birth mother, raised in a closed adoption, and reunited with my birth mother in 2007. I have worked in the adoption field for over 15 years.
Ron Reigns:
I’m Ron rains. I’ve worked in radio since 1999. I was the co-host of two successful morning shows in Prescott, Arizona. Now, I work for my wife who’s an adoption attorney and I’m able to combine these two great passions and share them on this podcast.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
Today we’re going to be talking about when families are not ready to adopt. Sometimes families will rush themselves into an adoption plan and not fully consider what it takes to adopt a child. And when that happens, you don’t always have a favorable outcome or an adoption journey that you hope to embark on when you begin your adoption plan. So sometimes we have seen families that jump into the process, even though they may not be ready to start and what can happen is there can be some marital discord between the spouses. One spouse may be ready and understand what it takes to adopt a child, while the other one may not be ready. We can see sometimes depression, anxiety, or panic between one or both of the spouses. In the end, even if it is a successful adoption endeavor, we can also see that they’re not as satisfied with their journey as they might have been had they waited for a time when they were ready to begin their adoption plan. They may have difficulty engaging in the adoption process, bonding with the birth mother, and really being present for their adoption journey.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
One last piece I want to address about rushing into an adoption plan when you’re not ready, you may find yourself making decisions that you would’ve made differently had you waited to fully understand what it takes to adopt a child or you were ready to begin the adoption plan. You may be happier in the end with the choices that you have made ranging from your placement preferences, to your post-adoption communication preferences, to how much interaction you have with your birth mother. A lot can be contingent on the state of mind that you’re in and the place that you are in your life when you are going through your option journey. We’re going to talk about this today because if adoption is on your heart and it’s something that you and your family or your spouse want to start, we just want to make sure that you’re ready and prepared, not just financially but emotionally, mentally, and that you have the tools to fully understand what it takes to adopt a child, and you need to gauge whether or not you are ready to begin.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
Some areas where couples may not be ready to begin the adoption plan would be the funding. Is your funding source secure? Have you set aside the full amount plus some for your adoption plan? If you’re applying for grants, have you started the grant process? Have you been selected to receive any grants? If you don’t have your funding yet, or a plan for your funding, that’s something that I would encourage you to have a more secure hold on before you do begin and just think that, oh, it will magically appear.
Ron Reigns:
It’s important what you brought up, not just to have the exact amount you need for the adoption process, you want to have a little cushion because things never go as you expect them to go. So having a little bit, it’s kind of like I tell my son, you don’t want to just have in the bank what you need to get by month by month, want to have a cushion so that when something happens that’s unexpected, you are prepared. And that’s huge when fully considering what it takes to adopt a child
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
It is. And what I have found is families that have their adoption expenses, they look at the number and they’re right on. But where I have seen unexpected expenses creep up is not even necessarily paid to the adoption attorney or the adoption agency, it’s things like the price of flights has gone up. Your paperwork is taking longer than expected going through ICPC and you now have to stay in a hotel for another two weeks, and then you have to pay for the rental car and it was more expensive because you have to eat out versus cooking in your hotel room. So, it’s little things like that that you may not expect. We had a family last year that came out, the birth mother was being induced and the doctor had set a date, the hospital, everything, and then at the last minute those plans changed and the family actually had to wait an additional 10 days and that was on the front end. And so, those kind of expenses seem small in the scope of the whole adoption fees, but they’re not when you really get what it takes to adopt a child
Ron Reigns:
Right. And your life is still happening at the same time. I mean, your car all of a sudden breaks down, where did that come from and what are you going to do about that? So yeah, that’s vital that you have a good plan ahead.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
Right. Another big area that is very important to really look into and do some soul-searching and counseling when considering what it takes to adopt a child, is unresolved grief. So over the last 16 years, I have seen families that have tried infertility treatments and they weren’t successful. That is very stressful in and of itself. When you get bad news from a fertility doctor and they say, “These just aren’t working. I would recommend you try something else where you have a better chance of becoming a parent,” I have seen families literally have a knee-jerk reaction and that afternoon are calling agencies and so forth and wanting to jump into a program because sitting with the grief of that appears at that moment to be too painful. And so, if they’re not pursuing one avenue they want to immediately shift to the other. I don’t think there’s anything wrong at all with starting to do some research, but you still have to resolve the grief over not being able to have a biological child if that’s what you were aggressively pursuing and not being able to experience a pregnancy.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
And those are really difficult things for a lot of people. And again, if one spouse is still in the mindset of, “Wow, I’m still grasping the fact that we’re not going to be able to have a baby through fertility treatments, and now we’re looking into adoption,” and their head is still spinning, and sometimes as hard as it is you really have to resolve that grief and then begin the process. And that’s probably the most important point throughout this entire podcast, because I have found that adoptive families that don’t resolve their grief prior to coming into the program will have a much harder time bonding with that birth mother. When they’re invited to go to doctor’s appointments, they either don’t want to go or they reluctantly go and that gives kind of a bad vibe to the birth mother who wants to share this.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
She hasn’t experienced the pain and the loss and the trials and tribulations of fertility treatments. So when she’s inviting you to come to her appointments and hold her hand during the ultrasound, she’s giving the best of her. And when an adoptive family is not able to meet her where she is, that can cause the bond to not happen and that can have negative repercussions because as you’re going through an adoption journey and you are bonding with your birth mother, you are formulating a relationship that if you have an open adoption, you will have for the rest of your life, as is she. And so, you are in essence cheating yourself, cheating your spouse, and cheating your birth mother of a relationship that you could have. This is again where we have seen some issues develop in an adoptive family’s marriage when an adoptive mother, let’s say, she was the one who decided, “Oh no, we’re not going to do any more fertility treatments. We’re going to shift gears. We’re going to go straight into adoption.”
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
And the husband may still be spinning like, “Okay, this is a total change of plans. What are we looking at?” And here the adoption agency is saying, “Okay, your birth mother wants you to at least be on FaceTime for the ultrasound so you can find out the gender,” and the adoptive mother is like, “Ooh, that’s hitting too close to home. I’m not ready to see an ultrasound with the baby.” And then the husband is thinking, “Okay, well we don’t want to lose the birth mother if we don’t show up for the ultrasound.” So now, we’ve got this mess. And if you can find it in yourself to find peace in where your life is taking you, you will be happier. You’ll be able to enjoy being at the ultrasound. It’s something that you wouldn’t want to miss for anything. You will be able to really connect with the birth mother and touch her stomach and feel the baby move and talk about all those amazing things that are happening to the child that she is giving to you.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
And again, if you’re still struggling with resentment and bitterness that she is pregnant and carrying a child and placing that child for adoption when you were unable to have a baby and parent your biological child, that’s really tough. That’s really, really tough. And there are amazing support groups out in the community, in any community really, where couples that are faced with fertility issues are able to go and get support. Again, not rushing into one program is beneficial for everybody. When you are embarking on a journey through fertility treatments or learning what it takes to adopt a child, you need to have a very strong bond with your spouse. And in the next episode we’re actually going to talk about this, but you need to build that foundation so that when times are tough and it’s three o’clock in the morning and you’re awake and you’re worried that something’s not going to go right, or you’re anxious about something, you want to be able to be in a place in your marriage where your husband is, or your wife, is in the same mental space as you so that together you can be this unbeatable team.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
And there are a lot of studies that show that the best thing that you can do to really solidify your marriage so that when you are faced with rainy days, you are able to open your umbrella and walk where you need to walk but that takes work. When there is discord between the spouses, there is some level of unhappiness and anxiety and worry that any spouse would have to focus on because you want to be in a good place with your spouse. Again, that’s going to take away from your adoption journey. That’s going to split your focus. And as we talk about when families aren’t ready to adopt, we want to make sure that they are in the best place possible. Another thing is, if a family hasn’t done education about adoption, it’s really important to do so to understand… adoptions look very different today in 2020 than they did in the seventies or sixties or eighties, nineties, it’s changing and evolving.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
We’ve got so much research and data that wasn’t available decades ago. And when families are not familiar with adoption and what is available, we see it right away and it’s our job as an agency to educate you on what it takes to adopt a child, but you have to have some foreknowledge so that you can go into a program and understand what we’re trying to explain so it’s not completely foreign. If you are having difficulty conceiving your own biological child, you have some choices. You can choose fertility treatments. You can choose adoption. You can let nature take its course and in time you will either have a biological pregnancy or you won’t. Or you can choose to not have children. And those are very difficult choices. There’s not, in my opinion, an easy answer, but it’s one that I would recommend if you and your spouse are not on the same page to see a counselor and work with a counselor together before making any of the four decisions.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
When you’re not on the same page with the choice that you are choosing, it’s important to look at why. And when I mean why, is it the path that one spouse wants to take over another spouse or is it the amount of the level of importance it is to become a parent? Or is there some ulterior reason that maybe you’re not aware of that your spouse wants to take a different avenue or not take an avenue than you do? Again, this is where counseling is so important. For families that have had to seek fertility treatments or chose to and were not successful, again, this is where a counselor can help you process grief and help you make a decision about what to do next. Some obstacles when you are deciding about adopting again would be funding. Fertility treatments are very expensive and when you are coming off of a fertility treatment and adoption wasn’t your first choice, and you’re looking at it as a default choice, think about the fairness in that.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
No birth mother would want to be a default choice. That doesn’t mean that you would have to choose adoption first. What it means is that when you are choosing adoption it should be at that moment your number one choice, and getting in a head space to where you are is vital. So again, obstacles that you’re going to be facing are funding, and accessibility, if you’re choosing adoption is one spouse in the military? Are they stationed at a remote location? That can create some challenges. What about feasibility? Is there insurance restrictions if you are going to be adopting your child? If you are continuing with fertility treatments what is their effectiveness with your body chemistry? Family support, do you have your family’s support or lack of family support?
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
Society, family, friends, pressure, when you’re looking at this is there anybody in your circle that has adopted, that is familiar with adoption, that has walked that path? Are you going to be able to get time off of work, sick time, Family Medical Leave Act? If you’re self-employed are you going to be able to be gone for a period of time when the baby is born? These are all things that you really need to consider when learning what it takes to adopt a child. We’ve had situations where a baby’s born prematurely and the adoptive family says, “Well, we weren’t prepared for that. We weren’t expecting that to happen.” And when you’re in an adoption, even though you are not the one that is pregnant, that is still intended to be your child. So biologically, if you were carrying this baby and you had the baby early, it really wouldn’t be any different.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
When you are learning what it takes to adopt a child and looking into beginning an adoption plan these are the following steps that I would recommend. Making the conscious decision to adopt by considering the following: your funding source, the child or infant preference, and then whether you’re going to use an agency, an attorney, or try to do this independently, I would recommend that you begin researching adoption options that you have, again agencies and attorneys, speaking with family or friends that have adopted and attending adoption information seminars. These are really good starting points so that you can slowly introduce yourself into the world of adoption. Then choose what type of adoption and entity that you would like to pursue, whether it is domestic newborn, international, foster care, foster to adopt, whatever path is the right fit for you and your family. Then it is completing a home study and then picking an adoption entity.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
So, picking the agency that you’re going to do your actual adoption through if it is not your homestead. So, lots of states don’t have as friendly of adoption laws as other states and so families from one state will get certified in their state, they’ll get their home study done, and then they’ll choose an agency or an attorney in a different state and that’s the entity that will actually find the birth mother, work with the birth mother, and do all of the work on the end of the adoption rather than just the homestead. And lastly, the biggest signs that an adoptive family is not ready to begin, I would say, are unresolved issues regarding failed fertility treatments, a previous failed or disrupted adoption, discord in your marriage over the choices that have been made to date, and if everybody’s really not on the same page. If you have a spouse that is kind of going with the flow and along for the ride, that’s not going to have the same…
Ron Reigns:
Well, they’re not going to be as emotionally invested and active in it.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
Well, it’s not just that, it’s really unfair to the spouse and to the child that you would like to adopt to not have the spouse on the same page. When we do adoption home studies, both parties are interviewed separately because we have to do our due diligence in making sure that both parties are wanting and ready to adopt. And I will tell you having done dozens of home studies, there are times where when one spouse is being interviewed, their feelings, emotions, and what they’re saying are diametrically opposed to what the other spouse has stated. And it’s really easy to pick up on when a spouse has been coached prior to the interview and it’s important for us to make sure that both parties are both ready and wanting this because again, placing a child in a home where one spouse is so into the adoption process and wanting to become a parent, wanting to do this, and the other parent has burned out and that’s not where they are anymore.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
And they’re not ready to jump back into the fire, if you will. So, we’ve also found that families that have had disrupted adoptions or failed matches, some of them want to jump back in and they do have that personality and mindset to where they are able to try this again. Just like a family that has had a failed infertility treatment and then they jump back in and do that again. Some have had what they consider a harder adoption failure or adoption match, and they’re really grieving over it, and those families need to take some time and then come back into the program. Because again, we’re going to see them coming in angry. When we have families that come to us after working from another agency where they weren’t successful in becoming parents, they don’t come in with the same attitude and demeanor when they’re unhappy as when other families come in. When they come in, they are more aggressive and they’re bitter and they’re questioning everything and they feel slighted, but we didn’t work with this prior family and we don’t have all of the ins and outs of what occurred.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
And so when they come in like that, and they are just so unhappy with what has happened previously, it sets a tone for their adoption journey that I don’t think that they would really want to come across as. So again, this is where I would recommend counseling. There are lots of counselors out there that can really assist you in moving forward and resolving your grief. Even during COVID you can do online counseling, and virtual counseling. That doesn’t mean that you have to wait. We as an agency, to date, haven’t slowed down all in terms of how many adoptions we’re doing or how many families are coming into the program. COVID hasn’t stopped families from continuing to build, but we want to make sure that you’re ready. Again, we don’t want you to be overly concerned to the extent that it’s not normal in an adoptive family because you have been, what you feel was, burned before by another agency or by a birth mother. We want you to be in a place where you have resolved that grief and that you can enjoy this to the best of your ability.
Ron Reigns:
So, when a couple comes into you as an agency and they are aggressive, and you can tell that they’ve got unresolved issues that they need to take care of, what do you tell them? What do you recommend to them personally when they come in? Do you just say, “You need time?”?
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
Not even just time, really more counseling, because when you have a really good counselor it’s not a process that has to take years or six to 12 months necessarily. It’s really taking that time and working with your counselor and processing those emotions and being able to find peace and close that door so that another door can open. So, we recommend counseling. If we have an adoptive family learning what it takes to adopt a child, present initially like they are ready to begin another adoption or begin adoption after having failed fertility treatments, and everything goes well in the beginning, and then they start to get nervous and we start to see some of the signs kind of creep up during their adoption journey, we do recommend counseling. Obviously, they’re matched at that point and they’re working with their birth mother and we just have to point out that unfortunately, some of the things that they have been saying, or their mannerisms with their birth mother or with their case worker, or their comments are not being well received.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
And so, everybody would be best served if they could work on themselves so they can be ready for when their baby comes and they can start enjoying every moment of their journey. Again, some of these birth mothers have, many birth mothers have not placed a baby for adoption before and so this is their journey too. And when an adoptive family is on this journey learning what it takes to adopt a child, and they’re carrying so many emotions with them and they’re angry, and they’re resentful that they’re not the one that is pregnant and they’re not the one who gets to experience the baby kicking inside of them, and they’re angry at the birth mother because she’s able to do something that they can’t, but they’re also grateful to her, those feelings come out in things that are said and the consistent or inconsistent communication that you have with a birth mother.
Kelly Rourke-Scarry:
And those are really important because you’re not just cheating yourself out of a beautiful experience, you’re cheating your birth mother out of one, and she didn’t do anything wrong. And so, it’s important to make sure that you’re able to be present in the moment and this is something exciting, and you don’t want to rob yourself of this time because as beautiful as an adoption is when a baby is born and handed to you and you meet your son or daughter, the journey is just as important. And so, in order to make sure that you are smelling every rose along the path of your journey you need to make that you are emotionally ready to do so.
Ron Reigns:
Thank you for joining us on Birth Mother Matters in Adoption. If you’re listening and you’re dealing with an unplanned pregnancy and want more information about adoption, Building Arizona Families is a local Arizona adoption agency and available 24/7 by phone or text at (623) 695-4112. That’s (623) 695-4112. We can make an immediate appointment with you to get started on creating an Arizona adoption plan or just get you more information on what it takes to adopt a child. You can also find out more information about Building Arizona Families on their website at AZpregnancyhelp.com. Thanks also go out to Grapes for allowing us to use their song, I Dunno, as our theme song. Birth Mother Matters in Adoption was written and produced by Kelly Rourke-Scarry and edited by me. Please rate and review this podcast wherever you’re listening to us. We’d really appreciate it. We also now have a website at birthmothermatterspodcast.com. Tune in next time on Birth Mother Matters in Adoption for Kelly Rourke-Scarry, I’m Ron Reigns.
